[Mb-civic] god will punish bush
Henry Howard
hhoward at pcmagic.net
Mon Nov 15 03:17:29 PST 2004
Ian wrote:
> Lyle:
>
> Don't mince words - tell me what you /really/ think.
>
> What I find interesting is that, hidden within the (very un-Christian)
> anger and insult in your response is the fact that you apparently
> agree with my basic premise about the statement I responded to.
> Because you now modify it by saying "Christ helps those who help
> others" (something I would agree with, for the most part), and ascribe
> the original statement ("God helps those who help themselves") to
> people like Dick Cheney. Enough said there.
>
> As for being the "unofficial Christian spokesman for this group," I
> have never said anything of the sort, and I challenge you to find that
> statement anywhere in the archives. If you do, I'll eat my
> rosary...(OK, I don't have a rosary 'cause I'm not Catholic; I'll find
> something else to eat). Indeed, such an accusation is absurd since it
> is simply not in my belief or my nature to claim to be the "official"
> spokesperson for /anything/, much less Christianity or this group. If
> anything, I am more likely to have referred to myself as the "token
> minister," since that it a more probable truth.
>
> As for accusations - even veiled ones - comparing me to "racist"
> missionaries, if that is the level at which you want to engage me, I
> decline to be baited. Suffice it to say that that would be like
> calling Gandhi a "warmonger"; since you know little or nothing of my
> history, you cannot possibly know how inappropriate your remark is.
>
> As for my beliefs - "dogma," "doctrine," call it what you will - I
> have made no effort to hide them: they are well known here, and they
> do not comport with what you (and many others) rail at vis-a-vis the
> "Christian Right" et al. And I will reiterate - yet again - that this
> is where many of you make a big mistake.
>
> There are right-wing, conservative, evangelical Christians, and there
> are centrist (and even left-wing), moderate (even liberal),
> evangelical Christians. And, statistically, the latter outnumber the
> former, even in Catholicism. Given this, when you lump all the
> Christians together in a big bowl marked "Christian Right" - simply
> because you /think/ that every evangelical Christian must be a
> right-wing, conservative, pro-Bush Christian - all you do is alienate
> an enormous number of Christians who might otherwise become allies.
>
> Keep it up, Lyle. You are doing more than you know to derail
> any valuable, positive, progressive discourse with potential allies.
>
> Peace.
>
> ---- Original Message -----
>
> *From:* Lyle K'ang <mailto:lyve at netzero.com>
> *To:* mb-civic at islandlists.com <mailto:mb-civic at islandlists.com>
> *Sent:* Sunday, November 14, 2004 10:28 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [Mb-civic] god will punish bush
>
> Stop preaching to me Ian-you are actually showing your ignorance
> by being ONLY Christian in your values or have you forgotten
> Universal values of the Spirit.
>
> You do not own your GOD!
> YOU do not own his teachings-you are ONLY to follow his teachings
> the BEST YOU know how-period, and from the looks of it you're
> following it word for word, letter for letter according to a
> million and one interpretations. Remember follow it by the letter
> and you too will become a fanatic or pretty close to it.
>
> Are you one of those that believe Jesus is coming back-Oh! by the
> way, there is evidence he did, in 68 A.D. Where is that written?
>
> Why should he come again, when you and I can't even discuss
> religion. You know where I stand on this man-made junk that has
> killed millions throughout the centuries...and where was your
> sweet Jesus then?
>
> You probably don't know what you're talking about either-just
> reciting dogma, intellectual banter, and indoctrination...
>
> Get off the missionary kick-too many people around the World are
> dead because of the missionary kick.
>
> I suppose you'll say and so many on the other hand are saved ones
> because of the Gospel. Saved from whom and saved from
> what-darkness? Who said these children were dark anyway, Oh! Skin
> color, therefore ignorant?
>
> White missionaries-give me a break, brother. I can preach that the
> LIGHT OF HEAVEN is shining on those who follow me (I mean that),
> and I'll get a lot of followers, is that what you're trying to do
> brother, have followers?
>
> Since when, did anybody anoint you king interpretor? Your
> statement a while back saying you were the unofficial Christian
> spokesman for this group just proves my point-white, hypocritical,
> no vision individuals' pretending to be in the LIGHT!
>
> The World no matter what religion, has too many of those. Too bad,
> too sad-watch out you'll end up like BUSH being an instrument of
> you know who...Look around on the city streets at the homeless,
> the children being molested, the truck loads being brought in to
> America as sex slaves-some only 9 years old and younger.
>
> Christ helps those who help others...rightfully so, Chenny
> believes 'Christ helps those that help themselves'...So many
> profess to be good christians (political) and every one is
> debunked-not one have I met lately that professes to be close to
> Christ in anyway, a true follower of Christ.
>
> I have met thousands because of their good works and there I saw
> Christ. No announcements that are closer, more spiritual, a.k.a
> Brighter...
>
> Look inside your own heart before you start preaching, really it's
> a sin in God's eyes-go scripture chase, like this is seminary...
>
> If it's not in the scriptures it must be wrong-My GOD, that means
> everything Buddha, The Mayans Gods', The Hawaiian Kahunas', The
> Rest of the Ancient World (Older than Christianity by the way), is
> wrong?
>
> Like I said, you and I are guest's here and I or you or both can
> leave anytime...you are not self annointed nor appointed....you
> are simply a guest here delivery YOUR message and not Christ's,
> period.
>
> Lyle K'ang
> Enterprise Insights:
> Tools for a Brighter Tomorrow...
> http://www.SiloManagement.com
>
> Please note: message attached
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Lyle:
>
> Although I agree with you in principle, please remember that "God
> helps those who help themselves" is not Scriptural, and it
> actually anti-Scripture: God helps those who have faith in /Him/
> and rely on /Him/. Obviously, this does /not/ mean we are
> supposed to simply sit on our duffs: there is certainly a time for
> action. But if you "believe," then faith and prayer come first -
> and then feel free to take action if you must.
>
> Peace.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* Lyle K'ang <mailto:lyve at netzero.com>
> *To:* mb-civic at islandlists.com <mailto:mb-civic at islandlists.com>
> *Sent:* Sunday, November 14, 2004 5:35 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [Mb-civic] god will punish bush
>
> How true you are my friends, we must stop the war but never
> stop whining about the elections. If you (we) don't hammer,
> who will? Our God? God helps those that help themselves.
>
>
> Lyle K'ang
> Enterprise Insights:
> Tools for a Brighter Tomorrow...
> http://www.SiloManagement.com
>
> Please note: message attached
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> it is horrible beyond horrible
> rapidly escalating to a rape of nanking/holocaust status
> but respectfully baker
> 45% ish of all americans are not like this
> unfortunately about 50% are
> situation very very grave
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> *From:* peter baker <mailto:djinbaqr at tiscali.co.za>
> *To:* Michael Butler <mailto:michael at michaelbutler.com>
> *Sent:* Saturday, November 13, 2004 11:29 PM
> *Subject:* [Mb-civic] god will punish bush
>
> bear
> ......these are the words of a fallujah woman...after the
> disgusting american 'clean-up'..her words are on the lips
> of at least 97% of all iraqis....iraq is about as big a
> fuck-up as one could possibly imagine...the iraqi people
> just want to be rid of the americans and 'their
> friends'....when will idiots like blair and bush stop
> telling blatant lies "the majority of the iraqi people
> want a democracy", "we are fighting for the iraqi people"
> etc. etc. ad infinitum.???...falluja is just one city what
> does ww3 intend...more fallujas going on and on into the
> foreseeable future ????more deaths, more
> suffering.??...i'd suggest that it's about time everyone
> got back on track...the election was lost, stop whining
> about it. the war in iraq must be stopped if america is to
> survive...as i have predicted time and time again the days
> of the 'american empire' are numbered unless the american
> people wake up.....mad baker
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Get a fucking life.
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