[Mb-civic] come on guys

[richard haase]

blah blah blah
but the church was still the mileau out of which much great art and the
society of the time came
evil and horrible though it was
specific; galileo who was persecuted by the church
could not have amassed his body of knowledge that led him to the point of
being able to do his own research were he not schooled by the church
teachers etc who were responsible for most of the learning of the day
certainly leonardo di vinci ambulating as he did in the courts of his day
could not but have been intimately touched by the church and its people,
directly and indirectly; i am a big iconoclast, hater of organized religion
for the most part etc; but whats true is true; lot of beauty in the church
and connected to it; even if you say it pales besides the human misery
caused by the european church(es) and you may be quite right; im being
quantitative; anthropological was not making value or even aesthetic
judgement
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Cheeseburger" <maxfury at granderiver.net>
To: <mb-civic at islandlists.com>
Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 5:27 PM
Subject: [Mb-civic] come on guys


> Re:  come on guys
>
>
> Richard wrote:
>
> ========
> one to ask of cheeseburger
> all that
> but to what purpose
> you seem to tear and tear away mr cheeseburger
> like a parody of ibsen
> very destructive underneath all the pedagogy and the flourish
> at least in signigicant part
> =========
>
>
> Give me some Specifics, Richard, then I will be better able to answer your
> question plainly.  Tear away, parody, Ibsen, destructive underneath,
> pedagogy, flourish....  You'll have to be more Specific than that for me
to
> address what you are asking in a significantly clear manner.  As to "what
> purpose"...?  What purpose what...?  Everything..?  Something..?  As far
as
> "information viewed on your screen coming from my keyboard", for the most
> part I take articles and information from encyclopedias, news stories, and
> historical documents and paste them up on the screen and occasionally
> comment on them.
>
>
> ========
> the fact is though the great great art those of us who are classical
artists
> draw spiritual nourishment was fostered by the church ( no matter how many
> textbooks you mimeograph )
> =========
>
>
> It wasn't mimeographed, it was cut and pasted from an online encyclopedia.
>
> People, anyone, can offer "rationalizations", "explanations",
> "justifications", "praises", "whatevers", day and night as to "the great
> things fostered by The Church", and all put together, all those "great
> works and accomplishments", =still= do not add up to being worth even one
> millisecond of suffering that The Church has caused to even the
"slightest"
> among us all.
>
> In even just one paltry incidence.
>
> The Church, long ago, ruthlessly wielded The Power Of Man using the
> justification and excuse of The Power Of God as a coverup to their own
> self-proclaimed "Divine Nature", and still have never been brought to
Justice.
>
> Again, all the "Spiritual Nourishment" drawn from all the Art in all the
> Centuries still remains not worth one millisecond of suffering of one
> individual caused by The Church.
>
> In all seriousness, anyone who doesn't *really* understand that "ultimate
> truth", remains as willing as The Church ever was to sacrifice humanity
for
> the sake of "Great Art", among other things.
>
> There remains no justification whatsoever for such a horror of setting up
> an earthly regime created and staffed by Men to rape and plunder and
murder
> humanity under the ever-present blessing of God Himself, including all the
> Art in all the world ever created over all of Time, nor any Spiritual
> Inspiration derived from its creation.
>
>
>
> =======
> and obviously we're aware that the inquisition etc was is monstrous and
that
> surely the catholic church which is swathed in gold while people starve
> still and has that inestimable real estate portfolio is monstrous
> ========
>
>
> If you are "aware of that", you shouldn't still be sitting here
proclaiming
> "Hey, we get Spiritual Inspiration from all that Art".
>
> To me it remains nothing short of something like a Nazi tank coming over a
> hill and the American soldiers taking a bead on it and then proclaiming
> "Hey, wait a second, look, they have a Rembrandt on top of the
> tank..!!  Cool...!!".
>
>
>
> ======
> so cheesey question
> =======
>
> Yes, Richileau, go ahead.....
>
>
> =======
> besides trying to tear everyone down and pick apart what everyone is
saying
> do you actually do anything?
> ========
>
> Again, you'll have to give me some Specifics before I can rationally
> address such a generalized personal observation.
>
>
>
>
> Cheeseburger
>
> - Where has the sparrow gone now that I need its song.
>
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